Episode 11: Mapping motivation for engagement with Steve Jones

Your team might not be lazy. They might not be disengaged either. They might just be doing work that does not feed what actually drives them, and you might have no idea.

In this episode of Speak Your Own Business, Kiana Douglin is joined again by Steve Jones, founder of Skills for Business Training, to unpack his second book, Mapping Motivation for Engagement, co-written with James Sale. It grew out of Steve's time co-chairing a government task force on employee engagement, and it will change how you think about leading people.

We get into why motivation and engagement are not the same thing, why annual surveys miss the point, and why the four things engaged organisations do differently (a clear story, engaging managers, a real employee voice and integrity) cost far less than losing good people.

Steve also introduces the nine motivators behind Motivational Maps and, live on the episode, maps Kiana. The result is revealing, a little uncomfortable, and full of lessons for any founder who gives too much away for free.

In this episode:

• The government task force that found only one in three UK employees were engaged
• Why people do not quit their jobs, they quit their bosses
• The difference between personality and motivation
• The nine motivators: Defender, Friend, Star, Director, Builder, Expert, Creator, Spirit and Searcher
• The barrister who became a landscape gardener, and what it says about skills versus energy
• Why promoting your best person can wreck their performance
• The 90 day conversation that replaces the annual survey

Lines worth pausing on:

• "People do not quit their jobs, they quit their bosses."
• "Your people are your single most expensive item after your capital investment, and you are doing nothing for them."
• "This has got nothing to do with skill set. It has to do with energy."
• "We all are guilty of assuming people are the same as us and motivated the same way."

Perfect for business owners, leaders, entrepreneurs, SME owners, and anyone scaling a team, or feeling flat themselves.

Free for listeners: Steve is offering a free Motivational Map and results review to Speak Your Own Business listeners. Get in touch via skillsforbusinesstraining.co.uk to claim yours.

Get the book: Mapping Motivation for Engagement (The Complete Guide to Mapping Motivation) by James Sale and Steve Jones.

Speak Your Own Business is brought to you by Plenty of Stuff Studio, a digital marketing agency working with businesses across Surrey, Hampshire, Berkshire and London.

About Speak Your Own Business

Speak Your Own Business is hosted by our directors, Tim Holt and Kiana DouglinKiana Douglin and Tim Holt. The podcast explores the world of business and marketing, from practical growth strategies to candid conversations with entrepreneurs and business owners who are making things happen. Expect plenty of insights, plenty of stories, and plenty of stuff to inspire your next big move.

We also offer video interviews for those who wish to share their story on a more visual platform. If you are a business interested in being featured, or would like to explore how a video episode could showcase your brand.

Get in touch with us for more details. We would love to collaborate and help you put your business in the spotlight.

Episode 11: Mapping motivation for engagement with Steve Jones

By Speak Your Own Business. In this episode of Speak Your Own Business, Kiana Douglin is joined again by Steve Jones, founder of Skills for Business Training, to unpack his second book, Mapping Motivation for Engagement, co-written with James Sale. It grew out of Steve's time co-chairing a government task force on employee engagement, and it will change how you think about leading people.

Monday, 5 October 2026

45 minutes, 29 seconds

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